On conspiracy theories about Zerodha

September 3, 2019
Why Zerodha?

Thursday, 29th Aug, was a tough day for us as a business. Our vendor-managed Order Management System (OMS) had a 30+ minute downtime caused by a single anomalous order, a new scenario they were not familiar with. We investigated the issue and published a postmortem report with technical details on the same evening, which seems to have been glossed over amidst the viral coverage and the trolling that followed. We also shared the report with the exchanges and SEBI.

The media coverage was staggering. We trended on social media for the wrong reasons. There was a panel discussion on a TV channel inciting their audience to tag and tweet at us. Our competitors jumped on the opportunity, as they often do, touting their own “bug-free” and “0% downtime” services, which of course is an impossible premise.

It was a very stressful event for us as at Zerodha. What caught my attention the most though was the slew of ridiculous conspiracy theories about us, mostly from sources that have no insight into how stock broking works or the strict regulatory framework governing it. Even the above-mentioned TV panel posited a conspiracy theory, which was quite irresponsible.

I decided to write this post to address some of these conspiracy theories. Non-response will probably start making them wilder. Now that this is on the public record for everyone to read, I hope the theories can be put to rest once and for all.

“Zerodha is the only broker that faces technical glitches and downtime”

I have been a trader most of my life and absolutely understand our clients being upset when trades are affected by technical issues. But now, being on the other side as a broker and a technology company, I know that there is no way to run a business with zero downtime. Every business, exchanges to stockbrokers, banks to e-commerce sites, everybody experiences technical issues and downtimes. Tech giants like Google, Stripe, Cloudflare, Facebook, etc. have had multiple global outages in the last three months. Two prominent Indian banks have had constant downtimes in the last two weeks. Unfortunately for a stockbroker, especially one of our scale, the impact of downtime is accentuated manifold.

The last incident before this one happened on 27th, February 2019, six months ago. One just has to look at Twitter to see that several other brokers have had multiple incidents in the past few months. Of course, our benchmark isn’t our competition. We are an order of magnitude larger in terms of scale and more proactive on social media than them. So, the attention we get is much larger.

To give you an example, recently, one of the top five brokers in India was down for over 2 hours and had less than 10 tweets referring to the incident. We were down for 30 mins on Thursday and were trending on Twitter’s homepage and news channels were flashing our name.

As always, we continue to innovate and improve our products every day, and work hard to prevent technical issues. As I’ve reiterated several times, our low brokerage costs have no bearing on the size of our technology investments or the quality of our products.

Order Management System: Our OMS is leased from, and fully managed by, Refinitiv (previously Thomson Reuters, now owned by the London Stock Exchange). They are one of the largest exchange-empanelled OMS vendors in India powering dozens of brokers, big and small. Our in-house products like Kite and our tech stack sits on a layer above the OMS. All brokers have an OMS connecting them to the exchanges, and apart from a handful who have their own legacy systems, every other broker relies on an empanelled vendor like Refinitiv.

While Refinitiv continues to actively improve their systems, the significant majority of downtime incidents we’ve had over the years have stemmed from the OMS due to our sheer scale, which our competitors do not have. The underlying infra and backbone for the Indian stock broking industry is quite dated and these are symptoms. We’ve been focusing heavily on R&D on building future-proof systems for much larger scales.

When somebody claims to have “0% downtime” or to be “bug-free”, they are being disingenuous. Any sufficiently advanced piece of technology can have bugs. The recent global fiasco that stemmed from vulnerabilities in Intel’s processors is a good example.

Zerodha should “upgrade its server”: This is highly misinformed. Our technology stack is highly sophisticated. It consists of dozens of servers spanning multiple data centers and is built to scale to several times the amount of traffic it currently receives. Every day at 9:15 AM, several lakh people log in to Kite at the same instance. Kite streams 30+ lakh market ticks every second to lakhs of traders who are online and processes 30+ lakh orders a day. Console’s portfolio and P&L breakdown data is in the tens of billions of database rows. Kite serves billions of chart candles every day. All of this is packaged into well designed, snappy user interfaces for our clients. We’ve built all this tech in-house. When it comes to retail trading activity and scale, we’re probably one of the largest trading platforms in the world.

Our low brokerage costs have no bearing on the quality of technology, products, and R&D. There is no “server to upgrade”. What would people have to say to Google about the major outage that happened a couple of months ago?

“If you’re not paying, you’re the product”

This is parrotted in many different forms by people who don’t understand our business model. That conspiracy is that since we offer free services, we must be mining our client data and selling it to 3rd parties, especially stock tipsters. While most of our clients only invest in stocks and direct mutual funds from which we don’t earn any revenue, we do charge Rs 20 per trade (or 0.01% whichever lower) for F&O and intraday equity trades. 95% of all trading turnover on the exchanges is from intraday equity and F&O trades. We have the largest retail trading community of intraday equity and F&O traders in India trading with us.

Offering free equity investments helps us grow the capital market ecosystem in India and grow our client base. But like I’ve always said, the lion’s share of our revenue comes from the active traders, who execute 15+ lakh revenue-generating trades daily. Do the math and one can know why we are a Rs 500+ crore topline business.

As a technology company, we have kept our operating costs extremely low by developing technology for not just our users, but internally for our operations. We have the highest gross margins and are probably the most profitable retail-only stock broker in India. Both within the industry and internationally, we’re considered a fintech company more than brokerage business.

The largest VC and PE firms in the world have been keen on investing in us at billion-dollar valuations. A leading global bank, in a recent publication, ascribed a multi-billion dollar valuation to us. But, we’ve never raised external money because we’ve always been profitable and have been able to grow on the merits of our products. We’ve never advertised, which cannot be said of our competition who have large budgets for online, print, and TV advertising. The quality of our products and the goodwill we’ve earned from our clients is why we’re the largest broker in India today.

Coming back to the conspiracy theory, when we have such a high-margin, high-profit, high-valuation business which continues to grow, why would anyone in the right mind do anything which is detrimental, like selling our own client data to 3rd parties to make a few bucks, let alone to spammers and tipsters? We’ve been fighting tooth and nail to address the industry-wide problem of phone number leakage that happens at many levels. In fact, we’ve worked closely with SEBI in drafting the Cyber Security Framework that lays out strict guidelines for client data privacy and protection.

As a broker, like all brokers, we monitor aggregate client positions as a part of our risk management. This is mandated by regulations. We also have to evaluate every single trade from our clients against dozens of complex rules and conditions prescribed by the PMLA (Prevention of Money Laundering Act) laws to monitor illegal and fraudulent trading behavior. We do all of this in-house within our systems and perimeters. No client data or trades are sent out of our systems. Every broker is required to do this and those who do not are non-compliant with laws and regulations.

My recent post on Yes bank, where I shared aggregate, macro-level statistics that we generate as a part of our risk checks, incited a lot of conspiracy theories. We don’t profile or mine, let alone sell our clients or trade data (which would, of course, be in violation of numerous regulations). We don’t have a marketing or “data science” department that looks at financial data to target or sell anything. In fact, we don’t do any user targeting at all. One can go to the websites of exchanges and depositories to find richer data and statistics on market behaviour.

“The technical issues are deliberate and are for market manipulation”

This has got to be the wildest, silliest, and the most ludicrous conspiracy theory of all. That a heavily regulated financial business (regulated and audited by 3 stock exchanges and SEBI) will deliberately bring down its systems, cause their customers anguish, damage hard-earned goodwill and reputation, lose revenue, violate laws and regulations, all to “manipulate markets” by “placing opposite trades” is so wild and absurd, I don’t even know what to say.

“Brokers can make money when clients lose money, i.e., by broker counter trading”

Here is something startling—on an overall basis, active F&O and intraday equity traders lose more money to trading costs (STT, Stamp duty, and other charges) and impact cost (money lost due to the bid-ask spread), than actually to the markets. This is likely to be the same across all stock brokers.

If a broker does keep taking opposite trades on the exchange for their client trades, the broker would end up losing significant money eventually on the impact cost alone. Moreover, this would be noticed by the exchanges and regulators, who not only do audits but have realtime monitoring systems. Also, common sense would dictate that no smart broker would force their clients into losses and out of the markets, especially one that does not advertise and relies on clients’ word-of-mouth referrals for growth.

Also, in India, every single order placed by clients hits the exchange systems in real time, where they are matched. This is different from many other markets where orders may be matched and filled by non-exchange intermediaries (or “darkpools”).

The only place where this sort of activity is possible are places like illegal CFD (Contract for Difference) and binary options trading platforms that essentially take counter trades to every trade taken by clients, as there are no exchanges involved. There, when a client loses, the platform earns. Since there are no trade or impact costs, such platforms make profits if all the clients on an overall basis lose money. These platforms are banned in most parts of the world, so they are usually based out of tax havens like Belize, Malta, etc., and entice people to trade by offering extreme amounts of leverage using online ads. Every once in a while, when there is a black swan event and a group of traders earn significant amounts of money quickly and much more than those who are losing, these CFD / binary trading platforms go bankrupt. The last really big one was in 2015 when Swiss franc was unpegged and it soared 30% in one day. 

Prop desk: Like almost every other broker, we do have a proprietary trading desk. We can’t be building a brokerage business with so much passion and conviction if we didn’t believe that profits can be generated from the markets. Most of what we trade are low-risk positional delta-neutral strategies and investments in stocks and bonds. What we do as a prop desk has no effect on our clients’ trades. 

Also, brokers are required to upload detailed reports on self and client fund splits at the end of every trading day. Not once in the last 9 years of our business has our prop positions exceeded margins beyond our own funds. We are audited frequently by exchanges and SEBI and have never had any violation with regards to ours or our clients’ funds and prop trading.  

Stop-loss hunting

This is one of those seemingly technical terms that is thrown around a lot but has no substance. This particular conspiracy theory was discussed on the TV panel mentioned earlier.

I have been in the business of trading and dealing with retail traders for two decades now. I’ve personally interacted with tens of thousands of traders in person, over e-mail, on online communities, and on our very active forums like TradingQ&A, Z-Connect, and Varsity. I can say with great certainty that the single biggest reason why retail traders lose money is by trading actively with no stop-loss to the trading strategy. Many claim to make a mental note of the stop-loss, but only a few actually place stop-loss orders. And the majority of those few who do, cancel or modify as the price starts closing in on the stop-loss. So, in reality, the significant majority never really have a real stop in place when trading. So if there is no stop, what can someone really “hunt”? 

Secondly, over 80% of all trades today are on extremely liquid Nifty and Banknifty contracts. Assume Nifty is at 11010, and you get to know that at 10990 there are a lot of stop-loss orders. What can you do about it? Somehow magically take the market down by 20 points, fill those orders, and then take it back up? Even if someone did have deep enough pockets to move the price to a stop, how could this possibly be a profitable trading strategy in a market where there are lakhs of traders with different views, big and small, where no one person can control the direction of the market? 

The only place where “stop-loss hunting” or forcing clients out of positions is profitable is again on a CFD / Binary trading platform, where the platform is the counterparty to every client position. The platform can potentially hit any manual stop in place or push the price to the extent where the risk management system auto squares off positions for insufficient margins. This is the reason why most of these platforms give extreme 100 to 200 times leverage to trade. 

 On a regulated exchange platform, this isn’t possible. Exchanges also have alert mechanisms that trigger anytime the buyer and seller on both entry and exit trades are the same clients. This immediately gets escalated and the broker is required to provide an explanation. There are severe penalties and regulatory ramifications for such activities.

Tick by Tick (TBT) feeds: Finally, stock exchanges provide what is called tick by tick (TBT) data feed where you can track every single order, trade, any modification happening on the exchange. This data contains details of trades and pending orders at the exchange level, across all brokers. So if someone did have a strategy like “stop-loss hunting”, trying to figure out retail orders, etc, the best option would be to subscribe to exchange TBT data feed. It’s quite complex and expensive, but available to anyone, and is offered by almost all Indian and global exchanges.

“Zerodha benefits by restricting trading on OTM options”

Our low brokerage and superior platforms have caused a significant increase in our F&O business. But since F&O business can bring significant systemic risk as well, exchanges have a restriction on how big a broker can be. No single stockbroker is allowed to hold more than 15% of open interest (OI) on any F&O contract. Once this limit is hit, exchanges automatically shut down trading, blocking all fresh entry trades and allowing exit trades for the broker and all their clients until the OI reduces. This happens automatically, and in realtime, and obviously, is a plight no broker would want.

With the introduction of weekly options on Banknifty last year, retail activity increased significantly and our OI suddenly moved towards the maximum cap, especially intraday. What makes it worse, as I explained earlier, is that most people don’t keep stop-losses and end up holding lots of worthless long OTM options when markets move. The only practical solution is to restrict the contracts in which a client can trade. Hence we stopped allowing buying deep OTM options (we allow shorting) which can add OI significantly with small amounts of money.

This is the real reason and we have explained this many times before. No conspiracy here.

On average, we have over 70,000 daily rejected Banknifty option orders because of this restriction. If you were to multiply this by the Rs 20 / trade we charge as brokerage, you’d guess the revenue loss the business suffers daily because of this.

Our prop desk doesn’t take any Banknifty positions to make the OI limit worse. However, we have realized that this restriction hasn’t necessarily been bad for traders. It has saved our clients a lot of money as buying OTM options is generally the riskiest trades to take; almost like buying lottery tickets.  

“Mock investors; encourage active trading”

My recent post on what not to do when trading (with Yes Bank as an example) went viral. While most appreciated the message, the downtime incident suddenly had quite a few people trolling me saying that I was trying to mock equity investors because they don’t pay brokerage and that I wouldn’t write something similar about traders who give us brokerage revenue. 

To clarify, I think almost all of us are traders. Buying a stock with an intention to sell in any time frame, or deciding to hold it until price appreciates to the buy price when the price goes against, is not really an “investment”, but a trade. Making an investment is like buying a house with the intent to live—you do it for reasons other than just price appreciation. Now if it is a trade (intraday, short term F&O, or even a longer-term equity one), there are a bunch of rules that need to be followed to protect oneself, and to improve the odds of winning, which is what I wrote about in the Yes Bank post. The trends of overall retail % holding in a stock and approximate average price shared can be figured out by looking at the historical shareholding pattern of every company publicly available. Nothing confidential there; just aggregate statistics.

Misselling: We do not have a single person on our 1000+ team that has a brokerage revenue or commission target. No advisors or relationship managers. Not sure how many other brokers can claim that. When there are revenue targets to be met, misselling happens.

When customers ask, we generally point them towards direct mutual funds (from which we make no commissions or revenue). We do not push any high-risk products. We never send out clickbaity F&O or stock tips inducing people to trade. We have spent thousands of hours building content and answering queries which are mainly focusing on helping people do equity and MF investments. TradingQ&A.com is one of the most active capital market forums in India, and Varsity is the biggest such open educational resource in the world, just behind Investopedia.com. The spammy marketing and stock tips, that’s just not in our DNA. I doubt if the entire stockbroking industry in India combined has as much content and engagement as we have on our free and open educational initiatives.

We’ve never taken the active advisory route because we’ve spent all this while creating the best self-service trading platforms out there. Our advisory has all been in the form of education. In the near future, we’ll start offering tools to our clients that will help them take safer trading decisions.

Closing note

We’ve grown to the No 1 position with zero marketing and gimmicks, purely through the merit of products and services and the support of our clients. We’ve
– disrupted the Indian stock broking industry and set a high benchmark for technology and platforms

– brought investing costs down to zero and have made trading costs negligible.

– democratized financial and stock market education by creating original content and giving it away for free and running large public community platforms.

– invested heavily in improving the capital market ecosystem in India—10 Fintech startups funded so far.

– achieved 1 million active monthly retail clients who trade and invest (source: UCC stats released by NSE), the highest for any broker in India, ever.

Alexa says that we’re the 76th most popular website in India (and the 1031st most popular website in the world). All this without ever spending a single Rupee on advertising or having a marketing team.

We have, thanks to the support of our clients, built a very valuable and successful business. We have zero debt or any external borrowings. Almost everyone on our team holds a stake in the business and most of our networth is tied to the business remaining valuable. There is no truth to the conspiracy theories being spread. The level was surprisingly intense this time around, and hence, this long post.

As always, we’re working on some major product announcements. Stay tuned.

 

Happy trading, 

 

Nithin Kamath

CEO @ Zerodha and partnering startups through Rainmatter to help grow and improve the capital market ecosystem in India. Love playing poker, basketball, and guitar. @Nithin0dha on Twitter. “You don't have to be a hero to accomplish great things---to compete. You can just be an ordinary chap, sufficiently motivated to reach challenging goals.” - Edmund Hillary

242 comments

  1. sivanna says:

    Appreciate your transparency.

    • Prashant Pandey says:

      Nitin I appreciate your endeavour of zerodha very much… Zerodha is a way out to be an businessman just sitting on a mobile…not ever think able… All complex problems have simple solution… These glitches doest happen daily.. what you have to do.. IS JUST TAKE AN INSURANCE AGAINST SUCH BLACK SWAN EVENTS AND BOOK IT IN THE BROKERAGES DO BROKERAGE FROM 20 TO 22 JUST 10% INCREASE I THINK WOULD SUFFICE YOUR INSURANCE COSTS VERY WELL… what would have happened if say the market have collapsed 500 or 600 points… The losses of the traders would be insurmountable.. Your company might have been closed.. Although I have full faith that you have very honest intentions.. But you would have to face even criminal charges.. You would not be in position even to write a blog.. All dreams shattered in just one day… So insurance against random technical glitches is ABSOLUTE MUST… Otherwise sooner or later as per Murphy law…. Regards from your friend and well-wisher..

      • kiran says:

        The problem is every day in Zerodah . Not only on that particular day . I have lost opportunities and Money because of this .If zerodah doesn’t update their technology , they will loose customers badly. I am moving to other platform in a week

    • narayana says:

      Sir,
      You are one of the cheapest broker.
      Naturally many like me have joined. I have dealt with others.
      i gave your frank opinion about yes bank. So everybody wanted to get out – there was heavy rush.
      Congestion/traffic jam took place. Sincerity and honest opinion you have give.n. I appreciate that. Pl. do not worry. If there is head there is head ache.
      All best.

    • Only shorts says:

      Dear Sir,

      I am totally frustrated with Zerodha as after market hours the app doesn’t work so it becomes very difficult to analyse the charts when we have ample amount of time. I would request you to please please please improve this service. One more thing your customer support are good and they really help me but this problem they couldn’t solve it so one more time a request to you to let the app work smoothly during off market timing like weekend.

      I hope you will do something to make such improvement and Thanks in advance:)

    • Deepak Halder says:

      We are a family..keep up the good work 🙂

    • Ganesh gd says:

      It’s artificial risk induced by zerodha . Retail claint should copansate money.
      They should aware of all technology and limitation still they don’t do any thing to over come it,. Refund money it’s problem is that oder management system is also damaged before this event too

    • Rakesh Shinde says:

      U are the best Broker ever…

    • k b rao; says:

      THANK YOU FOR the detailed clarification and explanation
      in a lucid way

    • Pushparaj Singh Panwar says:

      Hello,Nitin. Being a trader on Zerodha platform, I truly appreciate your sheer dedication towards Zerodha. I’ve faced problems as well but that doesn’t mean I can shift to any other platform. I’ve a intuition that you won’t do anything wrong to your clients in any case. We’re with you.

    • Rjn says:

      Nitin, none hv patience to read ths bible published here n tht too to justify ur bad IT-infra?
      Buddy, same time u could hv invested into grilling ur IT-Head?
      Lastly itz a pretty frequent isu tht v gt runtime errors n connection timeout etc

    • Paresh says:

      Nithin, you have turned this black day in Zerodha’s interest. I would have otherwise not known all the details you have articulated in this small post. Keep up the good work.

    • Vivek says:

      Nitin,
      We appreciate the low or virtual free brokerage trading platform that you n your team has developed.
      But it’s having serious bugs.
      My invested value of money has been reduced by around 2 lakh.
      Average price of stock is not getting updated after 3 days too.
      And many more.. I mean it’s a serious financial trading plate where millions of users are trading because they have faith in the system. But your platform is having many bugs which you need to fix on urgent basis. Else it will have serious implications for your business.
      You may contact me on my email and check from contact number from my associated account.
      I’ll wait for 3 days for my account correction before I file a complaint with all related authorities.
      Vivek

  2. Asgusg says:

    Yes, Sir, We do understand that technology has its own drawbacks. It could happen to anyone. Thing is you are the no.1 broker in India with heavy customer load. So, you came into limelight. You are doing awesome. keep it up.

  3. HARSHAD BORICHA says:

    I TRUST YOU SIR YOU ARE THE REAL HERO OF RETAILS LIKE ME. I HAVE TO PROBLEM IT HAPPEN WITH EVERY ONE BUT I KNOW YOU WILL IMPROVE THIS

    • Balaman khan says:

      Any comments on our data being compromised to Indore fake call centers?

      It’s highly unlikely they got data from elsewhere. How do they know we trade? If this can be compromised so can anyone’s order details.

      Also, your system seems to fail a lot more than others. To the point where you are now forced to explain yourself to us. Can’t be coincidental.

      Your reasons seem more like justification than any attempt to improve yourself.

      • Shrikant says:

        Hello, Initially I have referred Zerodha to so many people but after opening the account they are getting fake calls from different tips providers. Also I was surprised when I see your ‘Yes Bank’ post…How can you publish data about your client holdings……I am seriously thinking to shift my Dmat account.

      • Sachin Jha says:

        Hahaha…

        Indore call centre calls, me and my colleagues always faces. If we start trading after 5-7 days gaps we immediately started getting call from MP nos.

        • Faisal says:

          Balaman, Shrikant and Sachin,

          We can confirm that there is no data leak from our offices. However, there are other parties involved when you open a trading account, the stock exchanges and the depositories.

          To curb this, we have started a campaign(https://fightstocktips.zerodha.com/). We request you to report all such calls.

  4. Raj says:

    Keep up the good work n disregard the trolls

  5. Ranjeet says:

    Dear Nithin sir,

    As per my past experience as employee of one of the big broker. System failure happend no one insure 100% that her or his system is bug free.
    In terms of zerodha this is discount broker and got lot of order from many client rather then other broker in india After that zerodha manager well with low cost.

    You and your team doing best.

    कुछ तो लोग कहेंगे लोगो का काम है कहना ।

  6. kamal says:

    thanks… keep go….

  7. rajiv says:

    Hi Zerodha,

    you guys are doing a great job… but the truth is you need to improve and there is always that scope. clients loosing money cannot be accepted for technical glitches and appropriate compensation is the need of the hour. it hurts when you say other brokers also go through the same issues. but then we are with zerodha and want it to be the best for us.

    • Ram says:

      Nithin,

      Absolutely agree with Rajeev!!

      Every Expiry is painfully slow and issue prone.

      When you say Rule number 1 is Stop Loss, a lot of times we are not allowed to place the limits of our choice (Outside Range / etc.) and how does one place a stop loss when the system is Down and / or we get kicked out of our positions due to margin calls / your RMS?

      You should make GTT standard / free for all Traders. That way we can put in our SL’S and won’t have to worry if the system is Down!

      Also, your exposure and liability to Black Swan Events are limited. It’s a win – win.

      You need to have your OMS Guys scale up to match expiry volumes and not try to manage with the least / min. Viable product.

      When your system works, it works well!

      Sort out this issue and your valuations will also go up and we all wish you the very best in the future!

      Also, we need some heat maps!

  8. Anil says:

    Dear Kamath,

    Appreciate your concern about the customers and tried to put the issue as much as possible. But, I want to let you know one thing is… most of the traders not hurt because of OMS down for 30mins, but the time taken to cancel the pending orders with exchange (which your team has done manually), and same time requesting huge margins to close the existing trades due to expiry week (Example: I have an exit order which the margin was blocked by Zerodha due to pending cancellation process happening, that’s where most people hurt). Shouldn’t have asked huge margins for exit orders helped many customers to close their trades in profit or either in small loss. But, due to this issue, many traders were booked huge losses also.

    And, another hurting point is your customer care, it hardly connects and not a good response from them after connects.

    I hope you understand the issue clearly.

    Thanks,
    Anil V.

    • Chandran siva perumal says:

      I completely agree with Anil, whenever there is high volatility your system are down and now I see these glitch happening very often.
      Your customers service is very pathetic which never connects.

      I had a instance we I could not reach customer service and you trading system we down and could not sell the order. I had to rush to your office at JP Nagar office and the customer support there as well was pathetic. Had to wait for more than 30 mins to resolve the issue. Due to which I had to book loss. There are lot is instance were I have booked loss due to unstable system.

      Please wake you to reality rather than defending.

      Regards,
      Chandran

      • Anand says:

        Hello Sir,
        No doubt..there are many problems in Zerodha system. No response of server many times appear. Mostly time system respond very slowly. Recently I booked loss due to system error, two orders placed as in first order got error no response from server and then place second order but realize after some time that both order took placed and my position got reversed. I have one more account with other broker and in span of 10 year faced one time this type of issue.

        Br//
        Anand

    • NIranjan says:

      Yup, this is true. It exactly happened with me. I saw money the profit waning away in front of my eyes and when I called the customer care (after dailing for 30 mintues), the customer care closed my position at market rate despite me telling him the exact rate and then he apologised. This is not expected. Downtime is ok, but not able to exit position and exiting position by customer care without confirmation to customer is bad.

  9. Abhishek kandari says:

    Dear Nithin,
    I am using zerodha for the last 6 months, & never found any difficulty. yes every portal has some technical glitches, work to smoothen them. keep on hard working, we are with u in all this….

  10. M Y VINOD KUMAR says:

    Hi kamath, I have read your article on Yes Bank. It was very frank and informative. Immediately after you published the article on Yes Bank, the downtime had occured at Zerodha trading platform. Criticisms are bound to come. Stay cool and calm. Technology wise some problems are beyond ones control. The best thing would be to ensure the problem(s) do not get repeated. Zerodha is doing a great job. Keep up the good work

  11. J says:

    This is a well-written post.
    Hats off to the Zerodha team

  12. Ajay Pinto says:

    Hi Nithin,

    I appreciate you taking time out to explain the situation and fully support you. I acknowledge the change your team has brought to broking business and how beneficial this has been to the retail traders. Your team has developed a full eco system of enablers to the retail trader which were not available or affordable earlier. Things like stock scanner ‘small scanner’, algo trading ‘streak’, options strategies ‘sensibull’, fundamental analysis ‘Thomson Reuters’ reports etc stand out and kudos to your team’s efforts in bringing them to a retail trader/investor.

    About the outages, I do appreciate you acknowledging that there have been technical difficulties, but now that zerodha is the number 1 and in a position to set benchmarks one would expect sufficient scenario based testing to have a robust system. Previously you have said that updates to systems happen over the weekend and sometimes due to unstable updates there is a outage on Mondays.
    People buy into brands because there is a trust that they work, but behind the scenes it’s the processes that take care of small things that give this impression to the customer. Something did go wrong with zerodha on this day and your team identified the cause. What would have been great was if there was also an explanation on how this scenario was not foreseen. How are the internal processes being tweaked to ensure these unforeseen scenarios do not put your customers through the trauma of being helpless while seeing their money turn from black to red. You very rightly advocate the use of stop loss, but how does one execute a stop loss when the system is down?

    This acknowledgement and explanation would go a long way to soothe nerves and continue the path breaking journey you and your team have undertaken with Zerodha.

    Thanks
    Ajay

  13. Akshat Solanki says:

    Although, I am a critic of Zerodha.
    This was a quite long, lengthy, and yet an informative post by Nithin.
    I already have opened https://zerodha.com/z-connect/traders-zone/lessons-from-trading-on-yes-bank this link to read further and understand things as a retail trader.
    I got to know about a lot of things after reading this post, but most importantly, as a retail trader and entrepreneur what thing stood out was, “Building & Running a profitable from Day 1”.
    This is really an important thing and a lesson to the people, businessmen, entrepreneurs who out there are raising millions and billions with no profits in sight.
    It doesn’t make any sense to pick up a name or two.
    But if you’re reading this, make sure you understand Zerodha, and its ability to run a profitable business, at the same time, scaling this huge, with no marketing team.
    Bravo Zerodha! Bravo Nithin.
    I don’t know if I should consider Zerodha, a disruption because according to me, disruption in the Stock Market would mean, each and every mobile user having a DEMAT account.
    But when it comes to Technology and Price, Zerodha is surely a disruption.
    That’s the reason, in my family of 4, we have 3 accounts with Zerodha.
    That all said, I am sure Zerodha Team will work on these bugs, technical issues, glitches and provide their clients like me with the best of things.

  14. arun kamath says:

    It is absolutely impossible to have 100% uptime in any services. Even billion dollar conglomerates gave such issues.

    Old money brokers are running when they are losing revenues.

    • arun says:

      All others can afford downtime, but not broking/trading/speculation business. Fortunes are made or lost in seconds. Please stop defending this. SEBI should penalize and penalize hard and deep so that Zerodha and Mr. Kamath learns a lesson or two. Anyways users are switching, he will in a very short time and with some analysis get the data. Everytime same defenses dont work.

  15. Yogesh says:

    It’s okay.. Not to worry. This happens in technology world,

  16. Gopikrishna dasari says:

    We trust zerodha..no trolls will break this trust. Keep growing with your customer friendly work

  17. Dinesh says:

    Nice write. Thanks for clearing the air. Naysayers will always be there.

  18. User says:

    Dont worry nithin we fully support you and trust you.

  19. Manish says:

    I’m guessing a lot of the frustration could be because the outage happened on F&O expiry day at a time when the markets have inflicted losses on a majority of traders…But my experience with Zerodha has been that the downtimes are much less than I faced with my previous broker (who still crows about being the best broker in the country). These things happen, and can never be completely eliminated. That is just one of the risks you have to manage when you trade.
    So ignore the conspiracy theories. You have built a remarkable business and it’s streets ahead of any Indian (or maybe even global) broker. Just carry on doing what you do best.
    Also, think very carefully before you accept outside funding, because then you will have to manage the business for the investors and not your clients. And normally what is good for the investor is bad for the client, and vice versa….
    Regards,
    Manish

  20. Jagdish says:

    I will share my experience. I have recently shifted to Zerodha. I had demat account with other renowned broker and let me tell you downtime were quite usual at that other platform, platform was not trading friendly, order executions took time – sometimes dropped, links used to broken several time a day, brokerage was very high.
    I regret why I did not switched to Zerodha earlier. Zerodha is fast, is elegant, very trade friendly, layout of the things on site is excellent.
    More over kind of interaction that happens at Zerodha is marvelous. Varsity has great content, it is so superbly written – complicated issues explained in such a language that a common man can easily understand. Q&A, Connect etc platforms have almost had all the information that I ever wanted to search for related to trading. Bulletin is great, article on Yes bank was fantastic. I came across various topics through Zerodha, which I had never heard of and went on to explore these topics (very recent being the disposition effect which I think I came to know about from Yes bank article).
    I fully agree with Nitin that there will be no site that will not have any technical glitch or bug or will have no downtime. I do not know anyone from the Zerodha time but the kind of content, layout, discussions, briefing etc I see at Zerodha and from my own trading experience I am very confident that management and team at Zerodha are very dedicated towards and committed towards making trading as convenient, real time and accurate as possible. I can feel that management has a great vision and have lots of concern about their product and customer. Nitin coming and explaining the root cause of the glitch, temporary fixes and long term planning is an indicative of their concern about the customers. I am not sure how many from topmost management from other trading platform do this.
    Keep up the good work Zerodha.

    • Zopad Patti says:

      I was watching this post and then my neighbor came and we watched it together. He said this post really changed his life and it touched my heart. My village people are so grateful. Am proud to say cool post wow thanks for sharing.

  21. Anish mishra says:

    Very well done sir, those who tried to belittle you must have got the answer. I being one of your client, thank you for providing such a great platform with virtually no cost. I must confess i am very satisfied with all your services.
    Thank you and please keep up the good work.

  22. Rajneesh says:

    Good that you showed an immediate urgency to quell the fires of conspiracy. I don’t think it will be first and last of it. There will always be people who try in vain to find shortcuts to success. But as long as your loyalties lie with delivering a transparent system that is working 99.9% of the time, nothing in this world can put you in our bad books. However, if I were you I would start to actively keep away from publicizing company’s claims of generating the largest traffic on nse/bse and other such things. I know it is true. But now that you are growing anyway by word of mouth it will only serve you better in finding ways to advertise your company as say “more investors/traders now with our company”. An indirect way of advertising.

    Anyway thanks once again for providing this wonderful platform. Regards.

  23. Aakash katoch says:

    Dear , Nithin kamath, I know its been a very bad day for you as well for your clients us. It is painful to see all your efforts and hardwork is forgotten by a single inevitable glitch of technology. I appreciate your
    hardwork and efforts to provide india with a economical environment for stock trading with top notch ever advancing technology of the country. Don’t be disheartened , its part of the journey these kind of times gives you experience and knowledge . Use it and learn to improve. Zerodha your dream project needs to be constantly evilving best version of itself. You don’t have any competition with anyone else but yourself and i know you will win . I your client have full faith in you. God bless you always ! WISH YOU A VERY GOOD LUCK AND GODSPEED !

  24. Raees Ahmed Shaikh says:

    Nitin,
    Clarification is good but drafted from the heart without a professional touch.
    You missed the point in stressing that downtime by other tech giants, banks etc referred in your email does not result in a direct financial loss to retail clients. All the good things/laurels are no justification for errors happening. Also, no clear mention of prevention of these/ not occurring again has been adequately stressed. Risk Management primarily includes anticipating risk along with managing the same.
    Further, in the hindsight, feel the post of “Yes Bank” could have been avoided.
    TV debates, well … who cares.. are for TRPs.. who cares.
    Regards,

  25. Saumya Bhattacharyya says:

    Situation like this sometimes help identify the future course of actions which otherwise get diluted in the easygoing.
    So, shake off the dirt thrown – we, the customers, are the Best answer probably against a handful of rotten psychopath.
    All the Best – Have an Wonderful Journey Ahead with Us….

  26. Siddharth Prabhakar Shetty says:

    In a world where hiding and covering up the news is the norm in business, it is commendable that you put this out.
    This is the transparency I expect as a trader from someone sat across the table. You definitely keep my and my account 🙂

    Thanks,
    Sid

  27. Arun says:

    👍👍👍

  28. Ashwin Ratlami says:

    Bhai everything else is okay, but next time don’t turn off customer care numbers in totality like you did this time.

    • Faisal says:

      Ashwin,

      Not all calls went through to our Support team due to the surge in the number of calls. We have added additional lines to curb this issue.

  29. Vishal says:

    Actually. You are the first trading platform which I ever used and still using. And I always love it. And you are the best. Keep it up.

  30. Santhosh Kumar V says:

    Hello Nithin,
    You have our support always with you. Your product is the best in India.

  31. Sudheendra Mallya says:

    Dear sir good afternoon…..
    Greetings of the day……
    This type of technical problems will happen in day to day life.
    We are all human beings….
    I feel myself happy for a member of zerodha brokerage.
    Please try to get solution for this type of technical issues in future.
    Thanks
    Warm regards 🙏

  32. Yogish says:

    Don’t bother about the naysayers, it’s their job to do what they are doing. Hopefully you next incremental improvement will keep in mind those who lost money due to the glitch last week. Keep doing what you are best at, bringing trading and investment to the common man. We are with you no matter what.

  33. Skonar says:

    Zerodha Like Reliance Jio.. Jio Aane Se Pehele Telecom Industry Pe Airtel , Vodafone , Aircel , Etc Per GB -251 Kar K Le Raha Tha .. Same Zerodha Aane K Bad Har Broker Avi Zerodha Ko Copy Kar Raha … Sirf Zerodha K Liye Aaj Retail Investor 0 Brokerage Par Invest Kar Raha .. Saach To Mano Retail Investor … Keep It Up Zerodha … Brokerage Industry Ka “JIO ” Hai Zerodha

  34. Harshal says:

    Great Job Mr. Kamath.. I appreciate your lion like courage to keep fighting against jealous market forces. Continue being strong as you have to fight many battles to remain on the top. We will stand by you. Thank you once again for Zerodha in our life:)

  35. Ramesh Krishnan says:

    Hi Nithin,

    No worries. You have changed the playing field and competitor donnot appreciate the change you have brought in trading and brokerage. You should ignore the troll and move forward. TV channels just make noise. Continue your good work and my best wishes for much more success in the coming years.

    Best Regards

  36. Kannan says:

    Thanks for the detailed blog. Sometimes I wondered when my OTM order does not go through. Now I understand the reason. Transparency is key in this business and i am happy that your are striving for that.
    All the best & Regards
    Kannan

  37. HP says:

    Downtimes due to tech glitches are common. Some people might have made profits also. However, people who made losses are highlighting. Profits/Losses due to tech issues is Fate.
    Zerodha being # 1 is not being digested by the competitors. We are with you !!.

    However, I request you to see that similar issues do not repeat as saying goes….making a mistake is opportunity to learn, repeating the mistake is crime.

  38. GRR says:

    Same excuse every time. It’s really irritating.
    Please don’t try to give a technical explanation because a lot of traders are strong in technical skills and they don’t believe your justification.

    So next time while bringing your code to production, test each and every corner case and also do enough performance testing of your application.

  39. Dileep says:

    Agree Sir, I can understand the scenario.

  40. ANIMASH SARKAR says:

    If any conspiracy occurs with ZERODHA…..then ZERODHA moving to the right direction….. don’t worry.

  41. Laxman says:

    I trust this guy even I lost money in my recent trade because what he saying is true. We know how he raised from the roots with only Mouth talk. He never advertised so far as I know.
    I sincerely believe in this guy what he is saying…
    Keep going Nithin.. 🙂

  42. Siddhesh Kamat Azrekar says:

    I’ve been with Zerodha plus a couple of other brokers since last 7 odd years of my trading career.
    Zerodha has always been the best since you never disturbed me with your trading advices as is the case with the other brokers.
    I’m pretty much sure all this conspiracy against Zerodha will bear no fruits because the clients will always stand shoulder to shoulder with Zerodha as we totally understand that whatever zerodha has on offer for us, no broker will serve with as much dedication and determination.

    Regards

  43. Sunil says:

    Sir you have given a solid reply to the channel who are defaming seedha.we are always be supporter of zerodha. You give us an easy platform to invest in Stokes by sip manner without any extra cost.

  44. Essa Malik says:

    Kudos to team Zerodha. Keep it up !

  45. Sushil Kumar says:

    I agree with all the points raised by you and I appreciate your transparency…..I know 100% uptime and bug free system may not always possible…..Though you try to achieve whatever maximum you can…..
    One suggestion pls…..Try to address your clients in a similar way atleast once a fortnight…Build a relationship with your clients through your messages and newsletter and that will definitely pay you in long run

    • Pranay Agrawal says:

      Hi Nithin, I am using Zerodha platform fo 5 years ( DP1501) . While i understand there can be technical glitches but my concern is you guys have not fully understood the harrowing situation traders had to go through on 29.08.19. Niether your post nor the official post mortem report from Zerodha captures the entire scenario. I am listing a few points here
      1) i had placed a buy side BO around 9.30 am , the system became inaccessible around 9.45 am. As market moved in direction of my bet, i revised and stop loss upwards. However same was in abeyance and my earlier stoploss got executed leading to loss of 1.5 k while i should have made profit of 3k by this time as per revised SL.
      2) This would have been still ok but to my utter surprise around 10.30 am i saw in orderbook a sale order was pending for execution. I tried to cancel the same but same was not allowed in kite. However I hoped this would never get executed as it was mentioned in order details that order was placed beyond exchange timing or something to this effect.
      3) but the pending spurious BO got execcuted without any target or stoploss around 1.30 pm
      4) I tried to exit from this unwanted trade but kite was not permitting the same as BO was temporarily banned by this time. I was stuck with this unwanted FnO exposure on expiry day when market could move sharply aganist my position anytime
      5) while there were flash message on kite mentioning that there would be auto square off of BO by 2.30 same didn’t happen in my case till market closing. Ihave screenshots regarding this and would share separately on mail.
      6) and finally which is most concerning part was that your call and trade lines stopped working between 11 am to 2.30 pm leaving your customers in lurch.
      In the end i lost around 3k while i should a profit of at least 3k, thus a total loss of around 6k.
      I am highlighting this with hope that you would completely understand the issue and the same is not repeated in future. Pls remember you are dealing with people’s money. If such incidents keep happening, mere apologies will not be helpful.

  46. Santosh says:

    The best mobile platform amongst all big brokerage houses.

  47. Nagarajan says:

    Sir,
    During that down time period also all my orders are got executed, may be I am small time trader and investor aged 55years. I was in mkt., on and off for 3decades are more and seen many of this going around. I wish always Zerodha the best at all times and everytime. I was taking delivery of high value shares on paper formats and found fake certificate when sent for transfer at company registrar. More I lost in huge values when my broker square off my holding citing a reason, delivery is not a possible solution.
    From year, 1990-1994, bruising years for me for bad deliveries.
    Now, we r in a world of on single click for entire operations.
    We have grown up well. We will grow with Zerodha. Till date, I never called them over phone for anything. Perfect broker. My loving brother and Dutiful stock broker
    –V S Nagarajan

  48. Viraj says:

    Being a tech platform manager I am impressed with your honesty and effort to set the record straight. I will continue to be using Zerodha

  49. Divyanshu says:

    You are awesome !

  50. ANIL says:

    Hello Nithin,

    I am in dual mind whether to believe your words or not. As we do not have any other better Broking firms, we are bound to stay with you. But this shouldn’t be looked upon as Upper Hand to let any fateful event happen with investors money.

    I have been observing Zerodha since a long time and I have had this doubt always ” That Whenever there is going to be a turmoil in share market, Zerodha App stops working ” causing heavy losses to investors. This is because I myself have lost a lot of money on days when we could actually gain or get away from losses. Any important day and the App or Online Platform has some or the other trouble..

    Other Platforms do not undergo any trouble during important event days.

    So I would request and suggest you to please do not let such occurrences happen on Important market days which will definitely spoil the good in Zerodha and belief of clients like us.

  51. V Kumar says:

    As an investor in stocks…
    Zerodha is great and better than others. Intraday traders might have some issue. Day by day your MOAT will deepen.
    Very happy to be associated with Zerodha

  52. Sanjay says:

    Perfect. 😄☺️

  53. Krishnan says:

    While you defend the media/customer wrath and attack on your glitches etc.,
    Please answer the following questions posed to you and your support team which have remained unanswered.

    Q1 Do you run dark pools in/from co-located servers in NSE & BSE ? I have experienced it on several occasions and have also been told by other Zerodha users about this.

    Q2 Do you have privilege accounts ? to whom you give preferential services ?

    Q3 Why do you not allow index option otm buy orders on expiry days ? Is it because you are protecting the positions of your big clients ?

    Q4 Do you sell “position data” through your associates sensibull and others ?

    • Faisal says:

      1 & 4. No, the exchanges in India do not allow order flow redistribution and all brokers are regularly audited to ensure that. We have been one of the most compliant brokers in India.

      2. No, we offer the same services to all our clients as per our flat brokerage model of 0.01% of the turnover or Rs 20 per order.
      3. This is due to the exchange OI restriction of 15% per broker. Nithin has explained this in the post.

  54. Suvajit says:

    Thank you Karthik.

    You guys are simply changing the way of trading for individual traders. Keep doing the great work and please don’t bother about the noises around.

    Thank you once aging!!

  55. Avinash Jain says:

    Appreciate your transparency but 30+ minute downtime in no# 1 company and specially where lot of money is at stake for individual clients is kind of unacceptable and you need to think to right strategy for your technology solutions. You have to accept that technical issue on your platform are quite frequent

  56. Malati Shenoy says:

    We appreciate your explanation.

  57. Mahesh says:

    Dear Nithin,

    Don’t get distracted by wild allegations. You have changed the game of trading in India. Carry on with your mission. We love your product. There is no match to what you offer.

  58. Udayan Ramakant Sawant says:

    I have done countless trades on my Zerodha account for 4-5 years , till now it has been very easy for me to carry out trade without any problem.
    At the start I had faced difficult in trading (which every beginner goes from that phase) but from my point of view Zerodha is the best. Specifically for its low brokerage charges.

  59. Parin Parmar says:

    Such things can happen with any technology… But it’s true that when one sets high standards, it is difficult to maintain them continuously and people expect such standards forever! All the best!!!

  60. NARENDER SINGH says:

    It happens sometimes…….. nothing to blame zerodha for that….. they are totally transparent and Kamath is a true committed entrepreneur who values honesty and integrity to its core. Hats off to this broking house for such rapid strides in a short time.

  61. P. Kikon says:

    I’m an option trader and I’ve been observing this kind of happenings in Zerodha and realised that it happens during rush hour – mostly on Thursday – option expiry day. I feel you may need to upgrade your server to handle the extra traffic especially during such peak hours. It shows that you have a large number of traders and maybe your digital highway is unable to handle them during rush hour. ALL THE BEST ….

  62. Sanjeev Khemani says:

    Nithin,

    Clearly appreciate whatever you have stated.
    What I don’t understand is why were MIS trades squared up at 3.10 pm instead of 3.20 pm that day. Did it have anything to do with the morning glitch ?
    Infact I always wanted to suggest something. Why are MIS contracts which are expiring on the same day squared up at your end at 3.20pm. Let them expire on their own. As a broker there is no additional risk to you. Hope you will give a thought to this.

    • Faisal says:

      Sanjeev, this was done as a precautionary measure due to the issue in the morning.
      Concerning not squaring off MIS expiry contracts, our auto square-off mechanism doesn’t allow to exempt expiring contracts selectively. However, we are looking at possibilities to allow for this.

  63. Bhavesh says:

    Hi nitin,
    I think you and team are doing great jobs, having technical issue are part of the job. More power to you.

  64. BALASUBRAMANIAN J says:

    Many people believe that zerodha makes good money during these outages.
    They don’t depend on brokerage only. Main revenue is through these outages and software bugs.
    Only messages were sent out by zerodha that the issue got resolved. But the issue was not at all resolved till the end. Even at the end of the day my order was there in pending status and my positions were there.

  65. Rahul Pawar says:

    Appreciate your effort.. Also please look in to system as zerodha candelstick are plotted almost 30s delay. This is very risky for day trader

  66. MAYANK says:

    Actually there was no need to write so much to clarify to all.
    A Giant is a Giant.

    There is nothing to worry about Zerodha. We, the customers, are with you.

  67. Naveen Kumar says:

    We trust you zrodha team . It’s great experience with you guys thank you .

  68. Vikas Khunteta says:

    You said that you don’t sell customer data I believe but your employees sell them, you are not going to believe this but this is happening since I opened my family members account. I manage their email Ids, I get SPAM emails for all of them at once, you can say that I may have used those email ids on other places on the internet but they were never shared except zerodha and they are exclusively built for zerodha purpose only. They all get SPAM calls too which is very risky because they are not educated enough to handle this. I personally have trading account in another company and I never get SPAM calls or emails. Please take strict action against such employees.

    • Faisal says:

      Vikas,

      We can confirm that there is no data leak from our offices or employees. However, there are other parties involved when you open a trading account, the stock exchanges and the depositories.

      To curb this, we have started a campaign(https://fightstocktips.zerodha.com/). We request you to report all such calls.

      • Bandar Singh says:

        I have been using other trading accounts as well. In order to put an end to the nuisance calls from the idiots at the firm itself, I thought I will switch to Zerodha because after account opening, we never get any promotional calls. But barely days after opening Zerodha account I began receiving these calls from Gujarat and Indore. Something is happening from somewhere. Have you considered the possibility of rogue employees misusing customer data? Another suggestion would be to completely hide customer details for everyone apart from senior management. If any of the RMs want to call regarding anything, they will dial through Zerodha’s systems that will automatically route the call to the customer. This setup is now being used by Ola, Zomato etc. The delivery boys or drivers won’t be able to see customer phone numbers.

  69. SubramanianV says:

    Zerodha service levels are good. Losing competitors are frustrated & you cannot expect them to behave differently . Just go through T series audio cassette success history & how competitors behaved. Pl protect yourself in ALL possible ways. Wish & prey for your continued success.

  70. Pinakin says:

    if I put your business growth synopsis in one line it would be “One Satisfied Customer will bring Ten new Customers for you.” Even I follow this rule and the only marketing tool that I use is “mouth to mouth publicity” as like You and the only marketing personnel that goes into the market is my “product.” So I can understand that an attempt to any such malicious stunts with the existing customers could be fatal. The Risk to Reward is Greatly Deteriorated…

  71. harish kumar k g says:

    all that you have spoken is very awesome and great but its on your part,
    saddest part is that you have never ever spoke even a word about those traders who suffered loss because of this technical glitch.
    you claim that your company has become no.1 company because of your clients right,
    then why dont you have taken any measures to compensate your clients those have suffered losses because of your technical glitch?
    even we understand that no one can compensate fully but why cant a part of it ?
    or any other measures to compensate in such scenario,
    since you and your team is so innovative in technologies why cant you or your team come up with an alternative to compensate the traders who suffers losses due to this technical glitch??
    like insurance,
    you take minimal annual premium and come up with a insurance plan

  72. A k Sahoo says:

    For believers like me no explanation is required.
    For trollers no explanation is sufficient.
    You are the best.
    Keep on doing the best.

  73. TS says:

    Zerodha should be loss at one thing that in spite of providing so much awareness and information on the demerits of intra day trading , the majority still do the same and believe in becoming rich overnight.

    Well I’m new to the trading platform, but I understand your point of view, and believe that you will maintain your customers trust like always and keep your team and technology updated/upgraded at every stage.

  74. Rajesh says:

    I think the real reason why zerodha gets so unfairly targeted is because its zero/low brokerage model has hurt established brokerage houses badly. Thanks for taking all the issues head on , though it is unlikely to silence conspiracy theorists. Recall, to this date, conspiracy theorists claim man never landed on moon!

    Keep doing the good work.

  75. Karthic says:

    Hi,
    1. One who tops the ranking table and remains unbeatable, will always undergo severe criticism, even for their smallest mistakes.
    2. Nithin Kamath always remains at a reaching distance to every single client, at any point of time. No other Brokerage’s CEO (who are second and third in the rank) are available to even hear our concern.

    You are converting every hurdles as a scope of improvement and you are improving day by day.

    If not Zerodha, I wonder what is my next option for brokerage. No one nearby to you.

    Keep going!

  76. Narayan Pathak says:

    Firstly, I really would like to thank you for coming forward and defending your well earned image, position and Goodwill. It takes honesty and openness for keeping things transperant.
    From being in a technical background myself, I totally understand how less merit above conspiracies hold about zero downtime and no technical glitches. As it’s popularly known that any piece of technology may face glitches howsoever advanced and sophisticated. I, as a customer and as trader appreciate your efforts for setting record straight. Having said that, I would also like your team to be in search la active feedback from your clients so as to know any ongoing problems apart from technical glitches which does not easily come to the surface. Apart from that great efforts.
    Keep up the good work sir!

  77. SUJEET BHUJBAL says:

    Need to improve customer care and email response team. Please take a survey of your customer care service

    • Faisal says:

      Sujeet,
      We are constantly working on improving our customer service experience. We have a feedback mechanism where every call and email can be rated.
      Do check your email for the feedback form sent to you and make sure you give the appropriate rating. This will help us serve you better.

  78. Rahul Garg says:

    Thanks (Zerodha), for there is someone we can genuinely trust.

  79. Ekta Upadhayay says:

    Sir all their life time these brokers has invested into bribing people and cheating customers best example icici direct. They cant digest how Zerodha rose by investing in people and technology. Sir please launch a support campaign. we all sign it that’s only way to slap these people

  80. Mayank Upadhayay says:

    Those people who have problem please quit zerodha and join icici and other brokers…..as simple as that…natak kyu itna…waha zyada brokerage and charges hai wo kyu nh bolte aap log…

  81. Narayanan C Chidambaran says:

    Thank you for the detailed explanation as well as the post mortem of this event released that day. Zerodha is the most modern and reliable trading platforms I have worked with. The quality and novelty of your products and the level of fault tolerance of your platform are amazing. Keep up the fantastic work.

  82. Apurv says:

    The rtdserver.pi option in excel is very slow, please do something about it, very slowly does it retrieves data.
    Also on pi, you cant select multiple rows at once.

  83. Vikash Choudhary says:

    Dear Zerodha Team,
    First of all big thank you for providing such platform where I can have some faith.
    Now coming to the point, there might have had some loss(money) to your precious customer and I don’t know if the loss are recoverable. But one thing I know is there are people or organisation around us who just wait for such things to happen. And if that happens they will not hasistate to exaggerate such things. So, you please focus on the the things which you do and be on top it always. Because even you tell the truth they will take as excuse.
    Personally I feel that your explanation is totally genuine and even though if they don’t understand then it’s not your fault.
    Keep up the good work!!

  84. Shailendra says:

    Dear sir,

    We are here bcoz we love the way Zerodha is serving our needs.

    Thanks,

    India is a land of speakers (Democracy). If we stop on every others questioning our status, it will be too late for the earning.
    Lets invest… only reason to tie us together.

  85. Gopu V Menon says:

    ur USP is your simplicity..and me having used the other portals…for me you are the best.

  86. BISWAJIT TRIPATHY says:

    luckily i made 12000 due to downtime. i was about to sale reliance at a lower price but by the time system was restored, i sold it at a profit of 12k instead of the 3k that i was supposed to make if i had sold it before downtime. Systems have downtimes, even our telecom servers go down causing false billing, network issues and so on.

  87. Sunil says:

    Hi Nithin, your post is very well and informative. Some or the other time we face technical glitches everywhere, especially in large scale transaction of information. Don’t worry conspiracies helps us to look back to identify the mistakes/loopholes which results in building concrete solutions. As I know most of the Zerodha clients came through self motivated and on trust base only. No media conspiracy will break the trust. Thanks

  88. Mayur says:

    I like the transparency and I am also into technology so understand this issue. I trust zerodha because he is the only stock broker who charges less along with multiple options to trade. Also there are good features available only in zerodha. I understand maximum users are in zerodha as compared to other stock brokers and one issue can be trigger as more hype by others.

  89. Sridhar says:

    Hi Nitin,

    We appreciate the facts and transparency in the business. I very well acknowledge the fact that there is nothing called “Zero downtime” in any large business model. As you said every one has a downtime and only thing is our intent should be towards negligible downtime. I believe you already have this in place, though i am not aware of the same…Do you have recovery backup servers, which automatically takes over when your primary server goes down for more than 2 or 3 min? Just think about this.

    Secondly in the better interest of investors, please introduce trailing stop loss on all the order types including positional ones. This would really help customers like me. Hope this is heard!.

  90. Himanshu says:

    Well explained sir.
    I agree with it 100% downtime should not be there but it happens sometimes. People yelling at it are two kinds people trading without knowledge. And other which want to break your customers to bring them to their platform.

    Thanks for giving insights also how it all works with nse and sebi. Learnt new things.

    Thanks zerodha for being the competition to full brokerage brokers.

    Lastly adding new chars by tradingview was awesome. Tradingview was paid and we get it for free.

  91. Atul Prakash says:

    Sir, the problem is simply that nobody ever observed how tech gadgets works, not even their phone which break down several times….
    This problem can only be understood by those who either tried to read your this long post or else a tech geek.

  92. Venu Gopal Pillutla says:

    Hello Nitin,

    Your clients know Zerodha’s true worth to the trading community and hence are solidly behind you. If anything, learn from the experience and ignore others. Best wishes and good luck.

    Venu Gopal Pillutla

  93. Sonam Dhingra says:

    Much appreciated post.. Thanks for being so candid about the business.. You’ll always have my respect and love.

  94. Ashutosh says:

    Hi @NITIN, because of your irresponsible handling of demat transfer from ILFS to zerodha. I have lost huge sum . I have raised a customer complaint regrading this also. You deserve this conspiracy.

  95. Safuvan Padannayil says:

    For well over a decade I was a customer of India’s leading legacy brokerage platform who charges hefty had quite dated trading platform. Switching over to Zerodha was a pleasant nd fresh experience for me at multiple levels- including the low cost (including annual cost and trading cost) and amazing IT platform. I am most impressed with how simple and user friendly the Zerodha platform is! Being an IT professional who work on building similar complex systems, I appreciate what Mr. Kamath is saying- there is no such thing as defect free system or always available system.

    Thanks for the informative write up. I learnt a thing or two new from it 🙂

  96. Neil says:

    Hi
    Happy to accept your explanation, comparing to the giants in IT, service and banking world class leaders is commendable.

    Do you know that all those big banks, you picked on have a compensation scheme if its the organizations fault.

    I am sure you have some sort of arrangement with your OMS provider for downtime and compensation in your SLA.

    Pass on the compensation to your retail clients and don’t let them down.

    Its sad that you are putting a brave face now but switched off your customer support channels at the need of the hour.

  97. Chandru says:

    I just love Ur platform for Ur transparency…. But sir please be aware of the losses that traders have to endure due to these glitches.. many times it might be even the lifetime savings. And it might be worst situation when they can’t make profit effect when they are right.
    Please anticipate and try to avoid as many glitches as possible..

    Thanks sir

  98. Bharat says:

    Nitin, some one takes you as a big competitor.. i think you have to take it as a compliment.
    No one runs with 0% down time. Its not possible. But its possible to not to admit it.. !!
    Best,

  99. Ramkrushna Tunga says:

    Now a days most users understand technology . Every where we face technical glitch . We are learning from this.
    This is not a big deal. Zerodha has working for a noble cause . I am sure Zerodha has capability to overcome all issue and conspiracy and shine like star in future . It will not stop only at No.1 . position.
    Thanks Nitin Ji for your explanation.

  100. Velu S P says:

    I always appreciated your effort for the simple and user friendly trading system. You need to improve methods to prevent failure. No recurrence of the same problem..
    Best regards,
    Velu

  101. Amol says:

    Hi Nitin… really appreciate your thoughts. Great job….keep it…. Largest brokerage r against Zerodha…

  102. Anandkumar Chidanand says:

    Nitin Ji,
    Personally, I used various other trading platforms in last 7-8 years. But, I found Zerodha one of the best because of it’s crystal clear policies, user friendly platforms and the best part is your Integrity. I never seen any other stock broker company caring for their clients so much as you do.
    Coming out with such a long and clear write-up, shutting the mouth of those, who with no reason try to malign the reputation, was a good move from you. This, certainly increase my confidence and comfort in you and your brokerage firm.
    And I am sure, the goodwill what you have earned over the years will surely protect Zerodha from all the negatives around. HAPPY TRADING…. 🙂

  103. Mahesh says:

    Thanks to Nitin and Zerodha for clarifications and detailed information on the issue.
    I would like to tell few points from my 15 years experience in IT industry working in Real time Data processing Domain.
    1. Compare Apples with Apples and not with anything else.- A trading software cannot be compared with Google or Facebook or any other social networking softwares as these Need Not Work in Real time, a minute delayed in google search results do not cause financial loss, neither a 3 minute delay in FB post causes financial loss. Trading system needs to be robust and needs to work in almost real time.
    2. Other brokers do not have as much infrastructure as you have.. they are spreading noise.. let us not worry.

    3. Bank systems also fail, but the loss/impact on customers are heavy and painful for users of Trading software.
    assume bank system fails, customers money are intact and value of money Does Not Change, where as, if trading system fails, then the stock purchased or sold has a varying price and this causes loss.
    like person A transfers money to person B and server fails, here money is safe and value does not change.
    Rather say a BO or CO or MIS order is partially executed, will the value of stock remain as it is if one of broker system fails? No it wont, this causes loss.

    Pls do the needful so that customers are not affected due to IT failures.

  104. vivek says:

    Very informative post – the point about SL hunting was hilarious yet sobering.

  105. santosh says:

    why does it happens on F&O exp. day only… both time i got loss …small investors like me its very tough ..alsomost 20000 gone ..ya technical glitches comes…but there was no communication channels at all…u ppl were not responding at twitter ,forget about calls…that was very tough day for me.

  106. Chida says:

    Mr Kamath,

    No excuse for downtime. Nobody needs justification, you need to improve your system and customer support.

    Downtime should be during weekend and not on expiry day.

    Since your system was down and hence people lost money in F&O trade.

    So news channel reported the same, I don’t see any issue from them.
    Please improve infrastructure and then zerodha will not be in news for bad reason.

  107. sk says:

    why should it happen on thursday ( on expiry day?)

  108. Akash KB says:

    Dear Team Zerodha,
    I have experience of trading with almost all leading brokerage houses in India like ICICIDirect, Reliance Money, IndiaBulls, Kotak Securities, ShareKhan, Motilal Oswal, SBISmart, Zerodha, etc.
    My experience with Zerodha since last 2 & 1/2 yrs is just AWESOME.

    This 1/2 an hr technical glitch is nothing in front of other full-service & discount brokers. This type of glitch occur every 1 or 2 months there. That also for hours together. It’s a routine for them. Last time when our BELOVED NSE also hanged & order possessing stopped for more than 1 hour. What happen to them. Nobody pointed a finger to NSE then.

    I am so happy & proud that I am a customer of ZERODHA. It’s a sheer luxury to trade on ZERODHA.

  109. Pavan says:

    Very nice article and it was nice that you wrote this article to the public against all the non-sense criticism. I have built several systems at scale and I know that unexpected issues happen. However, I hope your engineering team does a proper RCA on every such issue and there are no repeated similar root cause

    Wish you all the best

  110. Mohit says:

    Hello sir!
    Sir please allow us to take position(Nifty 2020 Dec) in nifty which have expiry of longer period like more than 1 years.
    If you have any extra cost then increase your charges.
    We need this product to hedge our portfolio.
    I hope it is realistic expectation from biggest broker.

    Thank you

    • Faisal says:

      Mohit,

      The problem is not the costs but the illiquidity in the contracts. While there is no risk if you are an option buyer but if you are an option seller, you could end up with a loss-making position with no option to exit.

  111. Harshit Gupta says:

    I agree to all:
    a) It’s a technical system and downtime are unavoidable
    b) Zerodha needs to insure customers against losses due to downtime
    c) If Zerodha doesn’t do b), reputation will be lost via once uncontrollable downtime & may be business if big enough impact.

  112. Kotireddy says:

    Nitin, Thanks much for continuous efforts to improve the quality and reliability of the systems. I’ve been with Zerodha for more than 2 years now and I see the systems are a lot better than when I started. Yes, there are technical issues occasionally and I too lost some money because of that, but those instances are definitely NOT frequent, and no way justify the false propaganda and trolling. A techie myself, I can say Zerodha undoubtedly has the most robust systems and people like me depend on it without any second thoughts. Please keep up the good work, and I’m sure your team is working hard to avoid glitches and improve the systems further, wherever possible.

  113. Mk says:

    I lost my money due to trades outside % Oi. It became inaccessible even to exit. I had to watch loose my entire money 50k. But other brokers allows to enter or exit. There is no restrictions there like how zerodha has.

    Also zerodha’s historical data and Api access is bloody expensive. Not clear why? Where as other brokers offer it for almost free.

    It is just a FANCY TRAP to use zerodha platform.

  114. Shiva says:

    Hi Nithin,

    I agree… i lost 21K which is more for a middle class people… I am afraid of trading going forward since my savings for 3 to 4 months lost in 30+Mins interval.

    I need to start over again with some cut down of my cost to keep my family happy going forward.

    thank you.

  115. Mohit Grover says:

    Very well crafted explanation. Appreciate

  116. Kumar Parteek Thakur says:

    Hi Nithin,
    I really appreciate your feedback and also happy to know that you are totally aware of your customers concerns and issues. However as you know money matters are really serious for every one who is connected to your platform or any other trading platform. As a fraction second delay in placing order (BUY/SELL) can cause huge losses. I have gone through the same situation earlier on Zerodha due to which my portfolio is under loss till now as it’s been more than a year passed. but being a CEO of a technology company I understand that bug and downtime is pretty normal and uncertain in nature. So no hard thoughts at all and keep up the good work.
    it’s really good to hear from you.

  117. Paulson says:

    I feel Zerodha is the only platform…..thats hassle free, fast and accurate….though a little bit of tech glitches at times….Zeroda stands best among all trading platforms.

    Keep your good work going…👍

  118. Preet says:

    Sir don’t listen to these trolls…Zerodha is the most transparent broking firm of India…Zerodha has helped us to be much more aware of how the markets work…has been upfront about the glitches whenever they have happened…WHEN A TIGER WALKS….rest proverb everyone knows…even Lord Rama was not spared from trolls…so don’t listen to such people…Keep going strong…

  119. Babu says:

    Atleast what you could do was to refund the brokerage amount for trades placed when there was a downtime. This could have atleast shown some sincerity towards the retail traders.

  120. Janakiram says:

    Appreciate your efforts in explaining. But you to see how many traders has been impacted but not on other brokerage houses. As a owner you know Zerodha has numerous customers than any, it has an impact when there is technical glitch. you have to understand frustration from traders/ investors.

  121. Supratim Bhowmick says:

    Will never trust a Gujju on financial matters. Enough precedence to prove my point. But this once I would like to believe that the Zerodha management are at least not crooks. Hope I will not be proven wrong on a future date.

  122. Vivek says:

    Hi Nithin
    Let me objective on this issue:
    Pro : Zerodha informs incase of an outage, other brokerages dont inform users of the same. Resolution time is faster compared with other brokers
    Cons: Frequency of outages is probably higher if I compare with other 2 brokers I trade with.
    Observation: Happens generally after a holiday. Is it because you install new patches without adequate testing?
    Please dont test or experiment with the system on an opening day or on settlement day

  123. Bhawana Dutt says:

    Hello Nitin,

    I understand your concern. But as an industry leader your responsibilities are also higher towards the customer.
    I also use Kotak securities for my trading purpose apart from Zerodha. Kotak securities has a technical glitch throughout the day, and my early morning order was executed at around 2.30 PM today.
    But nobody cares for the same.

  124. mukesh mehta says:

    sir, i am with you. .driverless google car also gets accident due failur of technology. carry on your business with us thanks

  125. Deepesh says:

    Nitin,
    There is absolutely no doubt that you guys are Top class start up and I feel proud of you . I still remember my feedbacks were worked by your team, be it simplification of login process or keeping your charges low.
    But, outages makes things very different in Broking Market, which you are aware fully. Your IT Backbone,DevOps along with Cyber Sec.T’s must be strengthened to perform extremely rigorous test beds over and over to test as many scenarios as you can as we live in cyber threat landscapes. All the best from my side atleast. At this moment, you deserve all my support and motivation. As said earlier, my money is on you and with you.

  126. SMB says:

    Hi, I fully trust you. I have been learning day trading using Zerodha since about one and a half years. Though I am not profitable as a whole so far, I have observed that yours is the most robust and transparent platform for trading. Analysis of my trades shows that whenever I incur loss, it is due to my mistake of not adhering to any strategy which is the most difficult thing to learn. Technical glitches once in a while are unavoidable . There is no need to worry about those who spread various theories in social media. Please keep up your good work. Wishing Zerodha all the best in the coming years.

  127. sushil says:

    Crystal clear clarification. I was wondering why Nithin wants to be so prompt in responding allegation, I almost ignored it as Zerodha user. But then I thought ‘proactive’ is the DNA of Zerodha. It is very insightful read.

  128. Arjun says:

    Hi Nitin,

    You are doing an awesome service. (Yes!! In a sense it is a service!)
    I am proud of the Zerodha platform. There is nothing like it in the WORLD!!

    You do not worry at all!!
    Real traders, who are mature as well, are not going to leave you.
    Whoever says he lost 5k /10k / 10L etc just because of downtime, is just amateur. It is just bad luck!
    (BTW, no one will ever complain that he accidentally made money due to downtime!)

    And regarding your competitors…. there is an apt saying in hindi … “Jab hathi chalta hai toe kuttey bhauktey hein”.

    TC.

  129. Kr Barman says:

    I just found out, Kotak securities are down from 6hrs https://twitter.com/jp_rajpurohit/status/1168827820216209409?s=21

  130. KG says:

    Hey Nithin,

    Larger one grows, larger are the problems. Wisdom says stay focused on solutions to your problems, noise will get eliminated.

  131. Bhupathi says:

    100% trust in you @nithin, don’t sense any fishy things in the last episode. Obviously as you gain traction, it is very important to deal with all this negative propaganda and you made wise decision by putting it across

  132. Raj says:

    Appreciate your effort for transparency. OMS is unable to handle large number of trades. will that impacted all brokers using OMS? I can’t see any news of other impacted brokers.
    Since you have large client base of day traders, its huge loss to many of them. I couldn’t exit myself from a profitable position during that time and resulted in ending up loss.

  133. Vivek Thebaria says:

    Fair explanation. As always, very transparently you have explained everything. However, is there any solution in sight regarding the 15% cap and thus BN contract restrictions?

  134. Umesh says:

    I strongly believe Zerodha is the one of the best company that came out of India, that too without PE money. Keep up the good work.

  135. S.Muralidhar says:

    why you have blocked funds on that particular day and one more thing pl. advise your staff to behave politely with the customers,more or less they are very arrogant. I don’t want your question your integrity, true to your conscious and i wish you all the best.

  136. Ramprasanth says:

    Trust and time is very important. The technical glitches will happen. But need to recover from it as quickly as possible since money matters. Remember once you lost trust, it is tough to regain.

  137. Eashwar says:

    Hi Nitin,
    please find some alternate solution when technical failure happens. like provide another URL and login and then we can able to cancel the order and square off the position.
    the same duration of time another broker can access NSE and do the trading but your platform didn’t.
    technical issue with live market for 30 mins to one hour not acceptable nitin.
    please keep the reliability on trading platforms or otherwise people will look for the another brokers and good platforms for trade.

  138. Praveen C says:

    I take most of your points except buying of OTMs.

    As per you, you consider blocking buying of OTMs is one way helping the clients and you compare it to buying a lottery.

    But people like me genuinely want to buy OTMs for stratergies lile iron condor where I need it for hedging.

  139. JJ says:

    Also, there is a technical glitch or delay in the first 15 minutes of market opening daily (happened today too). After placing an order in the 1st 15 minutes, it takes a few seconds for order execution by zerodha and by then the price runs away from my target entry.

    Please look into the same too. Thanks.

    • Faisal says:

      JJ,
      Our order execution has been seamless other than the issue on Aug 29. Let me check this with my team and get back to you over email.

  140. Vicky Patel says:

    Really appreciate for the clarifications and I think you make sense in lot of ways. my friend forwarded this post to me and I am quite amazed to see such care for clients and I went through your yes bank posts as well, nicely explained.

    A few months ago, one of your executives had called for account opening but I didn’t wish to as I had an account with upstox already, now since I have with you as well, I have to admit that comparatively, your app is BAAP of all the apps in the country, I wasted my time with different brokers looking for features that I never knew you had.
    Thanks Zerodha and People who read comments don’t open account with upstox if you are a technical trader, they are down today as well. https://twitter.com/upstox/with_replies

  141. Shyam says:

    Dear Nithin,

    MURPHY’S LAW SAYS .. IF ANYTHING HAS TO GO WRONG..IT WILL …

    Thank you for your note to your customers and painstakingly explaining the difficult situation that Zerodha Team was battling through to minimize the inconvenience to the customers.
    I have been using Zerodha was the last 1 and 1/2 years and its my personal experience that Zerodha is one of the Best Trading Platform. Zerodha is Excellent. As a customer I have unflinching Trust in Zerodha Team and more so in Nithin Kamat.
    As they say what ever happens is for good.
    As proposed earlier I think its time Zerodha charge at least a nominal fee from Customers. This still does not Guarantee that mishaps will never happen because Murphy’s law is Universally applicable to everyone.
    People who trade in Equity are people with Money and hence its time that we give back and reciprocate to maintain the Ecological balance.
    Good Luck to Heroes of Zerodha. God Bless You ALL.

  142. Priya says:

    In my case the down time was more than 2 hours. I had my options bought at 90. I gave a sell request for 115. Wanted to remove but could not. The value rose to 170. But unable to sell. The call centre people gave promises that are not kept. And at last it got sold for 115. I just took it as my hard luck. No alternate though.

  143. Jay says:

    You’re like South Africa cricket team. On a normal day, you can be a formidable side to beat, but when it comes to high pressure matches (read as expiry, high volatility, event based) you tend to choke and that’s what has hurt your customers the most. It is in these conditions of wild swings that a trader would like to have it’s system up and running to limit and salvage or take benefit of it. But precisely these are time when Zerodha tends to have some technical difficulties and betray the trust of its customers.

    Whatever explanation you might give, however convincing it may sound, the fact is people have lost money due to your system failures and you have not been forthcoming in your response to that.

  144. Pavadai Karthikeyan says:

    We appreciate your transparency. Just for a few minutes down time your competitors trying to blow out reveals their insecurity. VESTED INTERESTS cannot waste an opportunity.

    I have tasted several brokerage firms and the professional MARKET MANIPULATORS.

    Thousands of investors are with you. We will support ZERODHA. Go ahead with courage and firm belief on your vision.

    Wishing you all the best.

  145. daniel says:

    Hi Nithin,

    all said and done I like to congratulate you on your greatly enviable success. You are definitely unique(wrt no ads and yet exponential growth if i may say so). But keeping it short 2 issues-

    1.My banknifty order got executed 16sec later which i had placed at the open–today short sell at open. And no need to mention the price was almost at the target then. I remember you had said a year or so back that you guys had resolved this issue due to crowding at open etc etc and I noticed back then too that at open executions had improved significantly. Please do reply. If this continues its pretty clear that I will have to forgo juicy at open trades for the rest of my life by trading with Zerodha ! (my earlier broker had no such delays-it was instant-of course he had not even a fraction of your active traders forget banknifty)
    2. Please do add one important thing to kite web chartIQ-the countdown to bar close.(i think its available on TVC).I had requested this long back.
    Pls acknowledge your receipt of this Mr.CEO.(another of the privileges of a zerodha client),Thank you.TC.

  146. JG says:

    Nithin,
    daily I get calls from “stock tip providers” – this is happening since more than 2 years now. DND and all other measures to stop these calls have NOT worked.
    Zerodha is my only broker. So where do all these “bogus” tip providers got my no. from??????
    Whether u want to believe it or not – the data is being leaked from your offices only – otherwise how will these hundreds and thousands of bogus tip provider know that I am trading?

    • Faisal says:

      JG,

      We can confirm that there is no data leak from our offices or employees. However, there are other parties involved when you open a trading account, the stock exchanges and the depositories.

      To curb this, we have started a campaign(https://fightstocktips.zerodha.com/). We request you to report all such calls.

  147. SAGAR DINESHCHANDRA PORIA says:

    wow grt… super

  148. Rajib says:

    Dear Nitin,
    It seems to be a clarification for your self rather than for your customers.
    Zerodha hasn’t been having problems once in a while….it’s been having problems all along. I got into trading due to your platform (thanks for that) but now i have moved significant portion of my trades away from you. The only reason is, I am not sure about your system reliability.
    I read your statement of 0% downtime as an impossible premise. Can you please tell us is that your argument or is that an alibi? We all know that no system in this world is fail proof. But reliability is established when one sincerely tries to reach closer to it (0%).
    Your guys don’t even pick the phone during a problem and if they do, they are anything but polite.
    Your own statements show that, you dont treat small (i mean unnoticeable) problems as problems and you are pretty dismissive about it. Only when a problem reaches the media(social included), you seem to take notice yet your responses are excuses and dismissive of the problem again.
    I for one, would like not only to thank you (to have introduced me to trading) but also for keeping me away from you.

    However, out of goodwill, i would like to make few suggestions (if at all you care):
    – please ensure your staff are courteous and polite
    – please ensure problems are addressed in a believable and transparent manner
    – please spend time with a customer to help him/her and dont treat them as novices (while some of them like me are)
    – finally, invest time and resources in redundancies first and new products can wait a little while

    Hope, your platform gets better in future.

    Thanks,
    Rajib

    ps: BTW, i am writting this comment second time. In the afternoon when i posted first time, your system said “comments are closed”,,,,i dont know whether your message was a one-way street….if so, i am SORRY.

  149. Krish says:

    You need to invest and monitor till system stabilises..still we face issues in kite2..you are required to gain our confidence or ultimately zerodha will lose customers.

  150. Rajiv singh says:

    wish you all the best in your endeavors to provide best services ….great

    Regards,
    Rajiv

  151. Kartikbhai says:

    Dear Nitin,

    Thank you for ongoing improvement on trading experience.

    The hypothetical conspiracy blame by Zerodha traders OR by Independent market analyst , is out of place as such loose talk do not level up to the eco system in place.

    Without having complete understanding of the architecture of ‘Exchange – Trading platform of broker – Trader terminal’ , voicing concerns is creating system noise.

    Kind of you to hear out the noise and responding.

  152. Kusum says:

    Dear Nitin,

    Its a pity that when others cant perform, they get in to blaming the ones who do.

    Zerodha has been doing a wonderful job and i personally never found any issues or lack of transparency from tou guys.

    ZERODHA is doing a great job and that should only be your benchmark.

    Ignore the sceptics, they are more of distractors in this case then anything else.

  153. Ashutosh says:

    Simply ignore the conspiracy and other baseless allegations. You guys are doing a wonderful job

  154. Shuvaranjan Dash says:

    The data feed especially worst from last 1.5 years. In live market candle formation does not happen properly. Today due to a wrong candle formation i lost 3k as i followed zerodha chart. Anyhow as we no zerodha people will not fix basic but will come with extensions as streak, kite3, sensible. Its became a investor’s platform, not right for intraday.

  155. Jayendrasingh Chauhan says:

    Mr Kamat you need not to worry because clients like me always understand you and supports you. keep going I don’t have any doubt about your credibility.

  156. Prateek Gupta says:

    Hi Zerodha, I just want to let you know that I trade on Zerodha Platform using kite, But for analysis use Sharekhan Trade Tiger, IIFL Trader Terminal and Fox Traders By Reliable Software. But I have check many a times that the candles on Kite is different from all three terminals. Means if you place to buy any stock above specified levels if will get executed in Kite but is not executed in all other terminals. Even I confirmed the data from NSE TAME and Every time Data on zerodha Kite charts were wrong. Every time I have been. Given the reason that you can confirm and Match your order from NSE website. But there is some thing wrong. I doubt that there is something wrong with your data vendor. You should immediately work on this other wise Upstox will take a lead.

  157. Phantom Drake says:

    Why are you analyzing your clients data for their holdings (YesBank, TataMotors) while you have your own Prop Desk running. Stop Loss orders/Limit orders execution sugar coated to being manipulated by TBT Data feeds by Algo Trading firms ?

  158. Mrtb says:

    Appreciate the communication

  159. Praveen Verma says:

    Friend I had a big loss that day due to your so called technical issue. You are losing your credibility. Every time same excuse. Personally I have started believing what people are saying about you.

  160. Jamanadas Ratilal Patadia says:

    I am not familiar with any of the technical issues involved, still read the full text of your message, dear Nothing, and not only greatly appreciate your transperancy, but have full trust in Zerodha services and especially you.

  161. Srawan says:

    I absolutely agree. None of the system is 100% down-free. I am one of the victim of icicidirect on last month closing (Jul-2019) where market close was executed when I was in 12k profit. However, it closed in 18k loss…

  162. Jai says:

    We believe in you and your vision , good you wrote this article it will be eye opener for all.

  163. Lenin says:

    Hi,

    We know few issues will come in any System/Product. But, after resolving the issue you should have communicated to user properly stating that ” leave existing order which are still pending status and go for fresh orders”. you guys simply said issues resolved. Users are confused with existing order which are “validate pending”.

    In my case, when i see issue is resolved but, order is still pending and it took 40mins to reach support team, and they said ignore pending orders. How would we know till you communicate clearly. Please communicate properly.

    Regards,
    Lenin

  164. PRAMOD KUMAR says:

    People should ask themselves “how much money they are making” when Zerodha trading platform working fine. stop blaming others for your losses. Learn to takes responsibilities for your own action. Learn how to handle bad days, losses and keep moving in trading and in life.

  165. Suvi says:

    When you scale up and become a disruption to industry (where commission and cut back is rampant) it will create ruffle among those who were enjoying at the cost of others. A bunch of full service brokerage houses had become monolith in manipulating, extracting money through various ways and means; some of them included practices which were highly undesirable. If few of them are circulating conspiracy theories etc , its purely out of a panic that has set inside them for last 2 years or so. No one is giving a hoot about these unsubstantiated remarks.

    I don’t think any of your customer paid attention to what they are discussing on television or somewhere else unless some one has a malafide interest. Yeah, some times it create caution in mind of a customer; but what determines is own Profit & Loss. When it gets affected it creates sense of uneasiness and sometime survival.

    Service has issues and that’s about it. Nothing to do with conspiracy etc. No one has data and information to forensic here, obviously in absence of forensic these are merely noises, best ignored. Please focus on improving your services, your benchmark should be outperforming your own results.

  166. Gokul B says:

    Nitin, it is indeed possible to build a 0% downtime 7x24x365 system. I have seen multiple approaches being used for broadcasting tickers and executing orders in RT. I haven’t seen any US based broker going down for a single minute. Imagine the hell that would occur on wall street were one of the top 5 brokerages went down for 5 minutes.

    It’s not easy to build an OMS from scratch, but surely there has to be a beginning.

    That being said, Zerodha is one of the best interfaces in stocks that I’ve seen in 20+ years.

  167. Vamsee says:

    Not discussed about the real theory of paid tools…

  168. Suraj says:

    Cool, Nitinji we trust you.
    Best of luck

  169. Dharini says:

    Helllo there, my 2 bit on the whole issue. If you are number 1, you will get more volume. That means, you anticipate and provide for it. If you used third party ORS and built your system on it, still it is your responsibility to ensure that it works in all kinds of scenario or change your software provider. I didnt see any remarks on how you plan to fix this. Again, my opinion is, an excellent scenario testing of your software could have avoided this situation. Also, you are right, sometimes systems do fail but how quickly it comes up and how painless it is for the participants is very crucial (especially when money or life is at stake – for many i think it is inter-changeable:)

  170. Prince Thakur says:

    Nithin, can you please let us all know, why the limit on quantity is applied to the traders that too too loo, 20,000 ?
    i had earlier max quantity 999,999 but suddenly i am getting error for placing order of quantity more than 20,000.
    tried to reach on calling support, no answer, the operator picks up didnt say a word, and disconnects the call.
    Sent multiple emails no resolution, they say split multiple orders. no this is not good..
    it wont help..
    if you want you can increase your changes on orders but dont put in restrictions which were earlier not there at all.
    Or let us know if we need to look for other options in the market now ?

  171. Deep says:

    1.Since you are the leader in your Technology stack, why rely on third-party OMS vendor for order gateway? Why not remove the handshake layer and directly talk to the exchanges using your Technology stack?
    2. Its true you are leading the Technology stack from the front-end approach, your front end is cool. However the back end sucks big time and your root cause is your OMS vendor.
    3. As a techie and a trader I understand your frustration with downtimes.People lose money when you guys go down, and there is no risk mitigation as well. I might be on a winning streak for 30 days but one technology glitch on you end would lose all my funds and that would be my last day of trading. This makes trading extremely unreliable.
    You guys talk about automated trading. And I am big contender for automated trading. However imagine my situation – I have more than 20-50 active orders pending and then your system goes down.My trading career is over in 30 mins.

  172. Vinayagam says:

    Zerodha provides the best interface, charts, and majorly the varsity which has personally helped me a lot about knowing the market.
    The only broker which doesn’t charge any brokerage for delivery.
    I’m a loyal customer of zerodha.

  173. Suman says:

    Hey Nitin,
    This is about what you said for “Misselling: We do not have a single person on our 1000+ team that has a brokerage revenue or commission target. No advisors or relationship managers.”

    We know you have made many partners outside for your product selling and what you don’t know is their selling practices. They are misleading people with attractive offers like cash prize, free tips. One of such fake person is with ID AUOKPC , he forces people to open new zerodha account of your family member if he already have it/change email/change mobile/ and he earns more than minimum 5 lac per month in commission.

    Well commissioning is not a problem, it’s about the practice he have to promote your product. He teaches how to trade in market while he himself not trading , He’s just fooling people to make them to earn from market.

    I challenge you , if you can post history of his traders who are in profit after a span of 8 months. I bet even not a 5% of his overall referrals. It is just because he don’t know about trading and making people brokerage generator machine by trading again and again. I request you to verify this by following his some videos on youtube. At-least give him training in varsity.

    Such people are creating more loosers in market than winners just because of your commissioning model. He gets 60% share of every brokerage and the worst part is in all these Mr. Shubham , your office employee has great favor on him and you talk about we don’t have such person . Shame on you and that partner who are having such cheap business on people hard earned money. If he has guts then trade himself then show to earn from market.

    once you have given him best partner. Shame on zerodha.

  174. Anil says:

    Dear Nitin,

    Your explanation is worse than the situation, and comes across as a justification of what happened and how you are better than others etc rather than making things better. You talking about stop loss is like an insult to an injury to traders who lost money because you know what, people wanted to put profit / loss orders at market open but the orders DID NOT GO THROUGH, and THAT is the only thing you should have spoken about, rather than pontificating about how good you are and how we traders lose because of stop loss.

    Now let’s talk facts.

    I am talking about Monday, 26th Aug, beginning of expiry week.
    The markets are opening with a massive gap up due to relief announcements and this would fetch lot of money to OTM option buyers, which would be retail traders, which are mostly your clients. There are big fish who may not want this to happen. The market does open big, and the big fish start selling baskets on index stocks and OTM option prices, which opened at double the previous close, drop within minutes to breakeven, then to loss. Meanwhile, the retailers who would happily have made profits are struggling to get out of their positions and are stuck with a loss. Hey I was looking for a good till cancel stop loss order only, that too right after i entered a position, how about that?

    Clearly, some big fish benefitted on large scale from such glitches in your system. Routinely, writers will make money by eating premiums, and on one day when a retailer has something to look forward to, your platform takes away the profits. The trouble is, they know where your failure points are. How would someone be able to put in a massive penny stock order on expiry day and clog up the system? It is also worrisome that someone knows your systems better than you do. It is also worrisome to see your constant tune of client contact information leakage that you didn’t do it, when people are giving you ample evidences.

    You were good and we loved you for it. There also comes a time for all big guys to get arrogant because they were good at one time. Yes, you charge only 20 rs per order and are now lording it over the retail traders while boasting of 500 cr topline in the same breath to the world, can’t you see where your topline is connected to the small guys paying you only 20 rs?

    There are a lot of well wishers as i see in the thread above, and i am one of them. I am not a naysayer, and only telling you to listen to the pain of people who suffered for real. Rest is up to you. Hope that we see positive results of this ugly incident. Cheers.

  175. dennis says:

    how come stop losses are not getting triggered at the apt price but gets triggered very far away, in fact much lower even than the day low? how is this possible?

  176. Mr. S says:

    When retail F&O customer in profit position, your system glitches happen and it happens every time. You are a big cheater.

  177. Pranay Agrawal says:

    Hi Nithin,

    I am using Zerodha platform for 5 years ( DP1501) . While i understand there can be technical glitches but my concern is that you guys have not fully understood the harrowing situation traders had to go through on 29.08.19. Neither your post nor the official post mortem report from Zerodha captures the entire scenario. I am listing a few points here
    1) i had placed a buy side BO around 9.30 am , the system became inaccessible around 9.45 am. As market moved in direction of my bet, i revised and stop loss upwards. However same was in abeyance and my earlier stop loss got executed leading to loss of 1.5 k while i should have made profit of 3k by this time as per revised SL.
    2) This would have been still ok but to my utter surprise around 10.30 am i saw in order book a sale order was pending for execution. I tried to cancel the same but this was not allowed in kite. However I hoped this would never get executed as it was mentioned in order details that order was placed beyond exchange timing or something to this effect.
    3) but the pending spurious BO got executed without any target or stoploss around 1.30 pm
    4) I tried to exit from this unwanted trade but kite was not permitting the same as BO was temporarily banned by this time. I was stuck with this unwanted FnO exposure on expiry day when market could move sharply against my position anytime
    5) while there were flash message on kite mentioning that there would be auto square off of BO by 2.30 pm, same didn’t happen in my case till market closing. I have screenshots regarding this and would share separately on mail.
    6) and finally which is most concerning part was that your call and trade lines stopped working between 11 am to 2.30 pm leaving your customers in lurch.

    In the end i lost around 3k while i should a profit of at least 3k, thus a total loss of around 6k plus cost entering to additional trades. I still consider myself lucky as the loss could have been much higher, I also had presence of mind to take a hedging position on opposite trade to avoid further loss ( something which should have been advised by zerodha call n trade team) and luckily zerodha platform recovered later in the day to allow the same. However it must be realized by the technical team that it was not just one hour glitch. The damaging effect continued whole day.
    I am highlighting this with hope that you would completely understand the issue and make necessary arrangements to ensure that the same is not repeated in future. Pls remember you are dealing with people’s money. If such incidents keep happening, mere apologies may not be helpful.

  178. Jagan says:

    Hello Nithin, Matti,
    From Last fives years, I have surfed zerodha sites so many times, but always understood MIS orders will be squared-off at 3:20 by exchange or zerodha. But i never got conveyed by Zerodha about this charge for the auto square off. Not sure why you charge so much ( charging for each script) for square-off (equal to call and trade). You know, charge for Human effort can not be equated to machine work. How can you equate here.

    After five years I saw to total sqaure-off charges turned to a big amount, Strangely ( obviously? ) Kite doesn’t provide API to square-off, which is easy to implement and useful for the KITE API consumers.

    Still wondering how can I’m not aware of this hidden charge, which was so easy to eliminate.

    • Matti says:

      Hey Jagan, an email was sent to all our clients when we started charging for square-off. Also, this charge isn’t meant for revenue, but in order to encourage clients to square-off positions on their own.

      • jagan says:

        Thanks for quick reply. Total half or 1 hour beak down acceptable in a year. Cost of the infrastructure increases exponentially as availability requirement reaches 100% . We still like Zerodha, and trust it. So expecting squire-off ( or least existPosition for a script) functionality in Kite Connect API.

  179. Nick says:

    And yet again the system got stuck today twice already, though it was for short duration of 15-30 seconds. But nevertheless system instability is obvious on load

  180. Sriram says:

    Dear Nitin,
    Though I don’t believe in conspiracy theories and have been using your platform for more than 2 years and having reaped the advantages of lower brokerage cost and ease of investment, I do have a complaint. Hope you can address it :
    1. HDFC Bank stock split (1:2) – which happened on 19th September- showed as error on 20th asking me to enter the additional stock data and when I tried, it did not accept and entire day on 20th, showed as error.
    2. On 21st – today – i thought it would be rectified- but no – it shows the old quantity and shows a loss, whereas the market has started reflecting the split price.
    There is no proper guidance to such transactions and I am sure stock splits have happened earlier as well, but your system is not tuned to handle it.

    • Matti says:

      The split shares were credited to your demat account on Saturday. These will be visible on the platform from tomorrow. We’ve also sent an email, SMS and a message on Kite explaining this to all clients who held HDFC Bank shares.

  181. Lijoo says:

    People used to complaint about the support team of Zerodha.

    I had some problem with my Pi installation and sent an email yesterday. Yesterday itself one Mr. Avinash called me and he was ready to help me. Since I was busy yesterday, he came online this morning and fixed the problem.

    I should say thank you Avinash.

  182. Sachin says:

    Dear Nithin and Zerodha team,
    Its a really good, easy and evolving platform.
    I have been giving feedback / raising concerns over different topics through the tickets.
    Some good features just get lost in the communication with the customer care representatives who may not understand the seriousness/importance of those features.
    One such feature is having distinct positions for each stock per order.

    The current problems:
    1) suppose I put a LONG position for stock ABC for N quantity and another SHORT position for same stock for same quantity, the platform doesn’t show me any change in the positions tab (due to buy/sell cancellation in the algorithm it seems). This is really really bad experience.
    customer care team is suggesting me to put another type of order or different quantity.
    Why do I need to do that? To hide your bugs?

    2) another case is where we put multiple (bracket) orders for a stock.
    The position tab shows a consolidated profit/loss which in a way is good for overall understanding.
    Active orders and completed orders are also included in this.
    But personally I am more interested in whats happening to my individual orders and their own profit/loss. This can also help me in managing my individual orders and take a correct decision.

    I request you to look into these seriously and help in implementing them.

    • Matti says:

      Hi Sachin, all trades for one account are net off at the exchange level, so there is no point in showing each order as a different position.

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